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The Obama and McCain campaigns jointly negotiated
a detailed secret contract dictating the terms of all the 2008 debates.
This includes who gets to participate, as well as the topics raised
during the debates. We speak to Open Debates founder and executive
director George Farah. [includes rush transcript]

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Guest:

George Farah, executive director and founder of Open Debates. He is the author of No Debate: How the Republican and Democratic Parties Secretly Control the Presidential Debates.

JUAN GONZALEZ: Tonight, Washington University in St.
Louis, Missouri will host the first and only vice-presidential debate
between Alaska Governor Sarah Palin and Delaware Senator Joseph Biden.
The debate will be moderated by Gwen Ifill of PBS.

Senator
McCain and Governor Palin have been sowing doubts about how fair Ifill
will be because of a book she’s writing that’s called Breakthrough: Politics and Race in the Age of Obama. The McCain campaign and right-wing pundits allege that Ifill might be biased in favor of Senator Obama.

What’s
missing, however, is any concern about the fairness of the very
structure of the debate. The Obama and McCain campaigns jointly
negotiated a detailed contract dictating the terms of all the 2008
debates. This includes who gets to participate, as well as the topics
raised during the debates. But the contract remains a secret, and the
Commission on Presidential Debates, a private corporation created by
the two major parties, has refused to release the contract to the
public.

AMY GOODMAN: Open Debates is a nonprofit committed to
democratizing the presidential debate process. Last month, Open Debates
and nine other pro-democracy groups called on the Commission to make
the contract public.

George Farah is the founder and executive director of Open Debates, author of No Debate: How the Republican and Democratic Parties Secretly Control the Presidential Debates, joining us from Washington, D.C.

So, George, well, what are these rules tonight? What will they abide by, and who is making them?

GEORGE FARAH: Unfortunately, Amy, we don’t know the
extent of the rules, because, precisely because, the Obama and McCain
campaigns have absolutely refused to release the detailed contract that
dictates the terms of tonight’s debate. We only have limited knowledge.

With respect to the new rules that we do know about, because the
campaigns are terrified that both Biden and Palin will make a major
gaffe during tonight’s performance, they have severely restricted the
response times, so each candidate only has ninety seconds to respond to
a particular question and then, only two minutes afterwards, to have
some sort of discussion. This is in sharp contrast to the amount of
time that was given to Obama and McCain during their debate.

And, of course, Amy, you’re not going to see any third party
voices in tonight’s debate. The Republican, Democratic parties, who
exert near absolute control over these public forums, have determined
and made sure that no third party voices are ever seen on the debate
stage and can challenge their dominance of our political system. <!–more–>

JUAN GONZALEZ: Well, walk us through how we got to this
stage, who originally was sponsoring these debates years back, and how
this secretive nonprofit organization gained control of them.

GEORGE FARAH: We used to have a fantastic, genuinely
nonpartisan presidential debate sponsor: the League of Women Voters.
From 1976 until 1984, the League of Women Voters hosted our most
important public forums, and they made sure the debates served the
public interest rather than the interest of any political party. And
they had the guts to stand up to the two major parties.

In 1980, for example, former Republican Congressman John
Anderson ran as an Independent for the president of the United States.
President Jimmy Carter adamantly refused to debate him, but the League
said, “You know what, Mr. President? Too bad.� And they hosted a
presidential debate between Ronald Reagan and John Anderson that was
watched by over 40 million people.

Fast-forward four years later, the Walter Mondale and Ronald
Reagan campaigns actually vetoed sixty-eight of the moderators that the
League of Women Voters had proposed for the three debates. What did the
League do? They issued a scathing public press release castigating the
candidates for abusing the process, and the Reagan and Mondale
campaigns were forced to accept aggressive moderators.

Again, four years later, the League of Women Voters were
refusing to implement any contract that was negotiated by the George
Bush and Dukakis campaigns. They had negotiated the first secret
contract, a twelve-page memoranda of understanding, that dictated who
would participate and how the format would be structured. The League
said, “This is an outrage!�

AMY GOODMAN: You mean that that was longer than the initial proposal for the $700 billion bailout?

GEORGE FARAH: Nine pages longer. And they absolutely
refused to implement the contract. Well, guess what. The parties did
not like the fact that an uppity women’s organization, pro-democracy,
was telling their boys who could participate in their debates and under
what condition. And so, in 1987, they created this private corporation
called the Commission on Presidential Debates. It sounds like a
government agency; it’s not. And every four years, it awards absolute
control to the Republican and Democratic parties over our political
forums.

JUAN GONZALEZ: And who sponsors this organization?

GEORGE FARAH: Well, that makes things even worse.
Unfortunately, much of the money that finances the presidential debates
that are hosted by the Commission on Presidential Debates are private
corporations that have regulatory interests before Congress.
Anheuser-Busch has spent the most money of any company in the United
States on presidential debates, which is partly why every four years we
get a debate in St. Louis, and we don’t have a debate this year in New
Orleans, which is dying for a debate, and massive civic groups were
demanding that a debate be held there to highlight some of Katrina’s
problems.

Another consequence of corporate sponsorship is that the
corporations are able to give a contribution this way to both parties.
You know, we have limitations in this country. Corporations can’t give
direct contributions to the candidates. Well, the Commission provides
an end-run around. When a corporation gives money to the Commission on
Presidential Debates, it knows it is giving money to both the
Republican and Democratic parties, supporting their duopoly over our
political process and excluding third party voices that may be hostile
to corporate power. And all four third party candidates that are on
ballots this year are sharply critical of growing corporate power.

AMY GOODMAN: Who are the co-chairs of the Commission?

GEORGE FARAH: Well, you’ve got Frank Fahrenkopf and Paul
Kirk. These guys have run this presidential debate process for twenty
years. They first incorporated in 1988. At the time, Amy, they were the
heads of the Republican and Democratic parties. And they still—they
still run our presidential debates.

And it shouldn’t be surprising that these guys are willing to
sacrifice the integrity of the political process to serve partisan or
private interest, because they’re registered lobbyists. Paul Kirk has
lobbied on behalf of the pharmaceutical industry. And Frank Fahrenkopf
is the nation’s leading gambling lobbyist; he is the president of the
American Gaming Association. These are the guys deciding who gets to
participate in the most important political forums in the United States
of America.

JUAN GONZALEZ: But now, there have been occasions when a
third party candidate did get in. Obviously, Ross Perot managed to get
in some of the debates back in ’92. Now, what have they been doing in
terms of that?

GEORGE FARAH: Well, Juan, in 1992, the only reason Ross
Perot got in the presidential debates is because the candidates refused
to exclude him. That’s it. If the candidates had wanted him out, if
Bill Clinton had wanted him out, he would have been out.

Four years later, though, when Ross Perot ran again, he was
polling exactly the amount he was polling prior to the debates in 1992;
he was polling at nine percent. He had $36 million in taxpayer funds.
And yet, he was excluded. Why? Because behind closed doors, Bill
Clinton and Bob Dole struck a deal.

Bill Clinton agreed to exclude Perot as long as Bob Dole agreed
that there would be only two debates instead of three debates, that
they would abolish follow-up questions, and that they would schedule
those debates opposite the World Series. Bill Clinton was winning by
about twenty points in the polls, and he didn’t want anyone watching
these debates or any difficult questions challenging his authority.

And that’s exactly what happened. Perot was excluded, despite
$35 million in taxpayer funds. The debates were held opposite the World
Series, resulting in the lowest viewership ever. No follow-up
questions. Only two debates. And the American people had no idea,
because the Commission on Presidential Debates secretly implemented the
contract and took all the flak.

AMY GOODMAN: I want to look how the two major party
presidential nominees talk about the financial crisis and the
Treasury’s $700 billion bailout and how the third party candidates
address the issue. Let’s begin with an excerpt from the first
presidential debate last Friday between Senator McCain and Senator
Obama.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA: Number one, we’ve got to make sure
that we’ve got oversight over this whole process. $700 billion
potentially is a lot of money. Number two, we’ve got to make sure that
taxpayers, when they are putting their money at risk, have the
possibility of getting that money back and gains if the market and when
the market returns.

SEN. JOHN McCAIN: We have finally seen Republicans and
Democrats sitting down and negotiating together and coming up with a
package. This package has transparency in it, options for loans to
failing businesses, rather than the government taking over those loans.
We have to—it has to have a package with a number of other essential
elements to it.

AMY GOODMAN: So, the two major presidential party candidates
agree on the bailout. Now, let’s listen to some of the other
presidential candidates who were not included in Friday’s debate, what
they had to say about the bailout. This is Libertarian presidential
nominee Bob Barr.

BOB BARR: Now we have the federal government, the
Bush administration, coming to us, the taxpayers of this country, and
saying, “We want you to bail us out of the problem that we’ve created
over the last ten years.� You open the door to this, you throw open
wide the barn doors here, this raid on the federal Treasury, this raid
on the taxpayers of this country, you’ll know for a fact that it will
happen again and again and again. Already, others are lining up. The
automobile industry is already lining up for its bailout. The
Republican and the Democratic parties are complicit not only in causing
this problem through their bad policies, their bad legislation, but
also in proposing this bogus solution to the problem.

AMY GOODMAN: That’s Bob Barr, Libertarian candidate for
president. We also interviewed Independent presidential candidate Ralph
Nader last week. This is some of what he had to say.

RALPH NADER: It’s not clear at all why a bailout is
needed. That’s part of the stampede in the pack and the panic that Bush
and Paulson and Bernanke are pushing Congress toward. You know, it’s
eerily reminiscent, when you listen to Bush yesterday, of how he
stampeded the Congress and the country into the criminal war invasion
of Iraq in 2003. I mean, look at all his statements: this could do
this, this would do that, farms failing, small business, tada, tada.
The first question we have to ask as citizens is, why is there a need
for a bailout?

AMY GOODMAN: That’s Ralph Nader. And finally, this is Green Party presidential candidate Cynthia McKinney talking about the bailout.

CYNTHIA McKINNEY: First of all, we need a moratorium
on foreclosures. Secondly, we need to renegotiate all adjustable-rate
mortgages into thirty- or forty-year loans. We also need to make sure
that we redefine credit so that credit can work for small business
owners and individuals and not against them. We also need
accountability in the system—openness, transparency and accountability.

AMY GOODMAN: George Farah, it sounds like it would be a very
different debate about the most important issues of the day, if these
third party candidates were included.

GEORGE FARAH: Absolutely, Amy. Thank you so much for
highlighting the significance of third party inclusion. There is no
doubt that often the Republican and Democratic parties take positions,
in large part due to the corporate interests that finance their
campaigns, that are directly at odds with the opinions of either the
majority of Americans or tens of millions of Americans. And these
debates, which are designed to inform voters so they can make
substantive decisions, should be airing the ideas that are supported by
the vast majority of Americans that the two major parties are
excluding.

And historically, that is the role that third parties have
played. Historically, it has been third parties, not the major parties,
that have supported and are responsible for the abolition of slavery,
women’s suffrage, public schools, public power, unemployment
compensation, minimum wage, child labor laws. The list goes on and on.
The two parties fail to address a particular issue; a third party rises
up, and it’s supported by tens of millions of Americans, forcing the
Republican and Democratic parties to co-opt that issue, or the third
party rises and succeeds, which is why the Republican Party jumped from
being a third party to being a major party of the United States of
America.

When you exclude third parties from the election process, third
parties that the vast majority of Americans would like to see in the
presidential debates, you’re not only denying those people the right to
choose who they want to run for president and who they want to vote
for, but you’re denying the very fundamental and critical issues that,
in a generative democracy, we need to have aired in from of tens of
millions of voters.

AMY GOODMAN: George Farah, I want to thank you for being with us. Your website?

GEORGE FARAH: Opendebates.org. I’d appreciate if if everyone took a peek at it. Thank you.

AMY GOODMAN: George Farah, executive director and founder of Open Debates, author of No Debate: How the Republican and Democratic Parties Secretly Control the Presidential Debates.